Kings Road teatime fights......

Zargonian · Post by **Zargonian** » 17 May 2005, 08:20

I propose a forum that would implement a form of Passport Control.

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 17 May 2005, 12:38

Zargonian wrote:I propose a forum that would implement a form of Passport Control.

Most are inside passport control already!

Post by **wangi** » 17 May 2005, 23:17

They should cut the baws off the s***s that murdered that guy...

http://www.pbase.com/wangi/image/43519881

Sandra · Post by **Sandra** » 18 May 2005, 20:45

I was totally sick to the stomach when I read that in the EN on Monday.

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 18 May 2005, 21:50

I do not mind when they knock each other to pieces but words cannot describe what I think of these scumbags. Even on the occasions when people 'just' get a good kicking I still think the perpertrators should be shot at dawn.

CatzVP · Post by **CatzVP** » 18 May 2005, 22:43

These scum make you sick, I just hope that when found guilty, the yobs involved spend their time inside her majesties hotel, as prisoners personal soap boys.

Gemini · Post by **Gemini** » 18 May 2005, 23:12

CatzVP wrote:These scum make you sick, I just hope that when found guilty, the yobs involved spend their time inside her majesties hotel, as prisoners personal soap boys.

By all accounts CatzVP, there was also two girls involved in this young man's murder.

The news today reported that the young man who died has two
children.

CatzVP · Post by **CatzVP** » 19 May 2005, 05:57

Gemini wrote:
By all accounts Catz, there was also two girls involved in this young man's murder.

G, news is pretty patchy over here, is there any news on how the arrests are going? (I only get whats online)

anyway, male or female I am sure the long termers will look forward to meeting them in H.M.P.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 19 May 2005, 09:35

Pal of Porty wrote:I still think the perpertrators should be shot at dawn.

I think shooting at dawn is way overated, what difference does it make?

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 19 May 2005, 17:02

Latest on the Piershill murder from today's EN:

Police charge two more youths over man's death

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 19 May 2005, 17:23

Porty wrote:I think shooting at dawn is way overated, what difference does it make?

It makes sure they sweat it out during the long, long night!

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 20 May 2005, 10:54

Pal of Porty wrote:
Porty wrote:I think shooting at dawn is way overated, what difference does it make?
It makes sure they sweat it out during the long, long night!

True, but do you think if they were going to be shot at 5pm, they would be really calm and blasÃƒÂ© about it having slept like a contented baby the night before?

I think they should be told that they are going to be allowed to watch Babe. When iit gets to the end and the crowd get to their feet to do the whooping and a hollering, even the despondent murderer must feel a bit of an uplift. It would be good to shoot him just before that scene, but maybe not fatally at first.

Sound good?

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 20 May 2005, 11:55

Letting them watch the last 10 minutes of "it's a Wonderful Life" would really get to them but it would still be better shooting them at dawn as the night does wierd things to the mind.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 20 May 2005, 14:05

Why not compromise and let them choose what film they want (but no popcorn)? Then let them pick what time they want to be shot .They would also have to nominate a second and third choice time in case we were busy.

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 20 May 2005, 17:27

A response from Susan Deacon MSP to my earlier email:

I would like to assure you that I have been very much aware of residents' concerns in and around the Joppa/Esplanade areas in Portobello and have recently had a very constructive meeting with Inspector Norman Ward from Portobello Police Station who has briefed me fully on the steps which have been taken by the local Police. It is my understanding that Inspector Ward is writing to everyone who has raised their concerns, and you should hear from him directly in the near future.

I hope this is helpful, but if you wish to discuss this matter further, please do not hesitate to come to see me at one of my regular Interview Sessions.

I think I might just do that. Has anyone else written to voice their concerns?

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 20 May 2005, 18:21

One problem with the Movie idea may be that not all murderers like Movies, so it hardly seems fair to make them watch one, right?Particularly as a preface to being shot. Social services would likely create a major fuss.

I must confess this has kind of set me back a bit, I thought I had solved the problem of dawn shootings but sadly it seems not. Unless we can come up with something soon, executioners will continue having to get up at a godforsaken hoiur, either that or just stay up all night drinking. Which I suppose is not that bad a deal.

Hang on a minute,I may have a germ of an idea. , everyoine likes sex, yes?

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 20 May 2005, 22:28

Prombabe will back me up on this one. In the town where she lives, which is about the size of Portobello, they brought in a curfew for under 16s. There was a huge outcry about it and it even got on the national news with all the usual dogooders complaining. However, it worked and with the younger ones safely tucked up in bed (or in another town) the Police could concentrate on the ones that they could charge. Whether they moved on and terrorised another area is neither here nor there, it worked for Wigton and I'm pretty sure it would work here. The Chief Constable of Northumbria (who I presume is the same Chief Constable for Wigton?) was on TV last night outlining his proposals for a curfew in another town. Maybe we should headhunt him..

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 20 May 2005, 22:30

Excuse me? I thought you were our resident teenager apologist?

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 20 May 2005, 22:32

I resigned.

(or was I sacked?)

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 20 May 2005, 22:33

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 20 May 2005, 22:38

Calling for the people who did it to be shot, castrated or abused in prison does not bring back the dead, and it assumes a perfect justice system which always gets the right person.

If you consider yourself to be in any way more peaceful than those that carried out the crime, maybe the immediate advocation of reciprocal violence is unjustified, and even crass at this juncture?

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 20 May 2005, 22:46

It's human nature to want revenge. An eye for an eye and all that. This is paticularly true when your children are of an age where they are in a position to be a potential victim. I for one am glad this lot are off the streets even if it will probably be for a ridiculously short period of time considering someone is dead.

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 21 May 2005, 09:28

It's not just kids that are potential victims - it was a 25 year-old that was murdered - everyone is a potential victim. My mum lives in Piershill by the way.

If you thought it through - where would the revenge spiral end? If people on the forum are seriously countenancing the shooting, castration and organised prison abuse of children (15, 16 and 17) then I would say that their revenge would be as nothing compared to the revenge that said children's friends and relatives would then decide to seek.

I would rather be part of the solution than part of the problem.

Post by **wangi** » 21 May 2005, 09:33

Mr D, what would you say is the root cause of the state of the youth these days? Kids getting pandered to at every step, no discipline?

I couldn't care less about the "human rights" of the animals that murdered this guy. They are not human, they made a concious choice to beat a guy to death - he and his family were given no such choice.

And a 16 year old is not a child.

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 21 May 2005, 10:06

wangi wrote: I couldn't care less about the "human rights" of the animals that murdered this guy.

Just like they didn't care about the human rights of the man they murdered.

Gemini · Post by **Gemini** » 21 May 2005, 10:59

Epykat wrote:It's human nature to want revenge. An eye for an eye and all that. This is paticularly true when your children are of an age where they are in a position to be a potential victim. I for one am glad this lot are off the streets even if it will probably be for a ridiculously short period of time considering someone is dead.

I agree totally with EpyKat and Wangi.

Human Right's (in my opinion) are not taken seriously enough in this Country - In fact there have been no Human Right's cases held in Scottish Courts as far as I am aware.

Its laudable when you then read that Saddam Hussain's Human Rights have been violated and French Lawyers are seeking squllions of Ã‚Â£Ã‚Â£'s/$' in compensation because he was photographed in his Y's!

By comparison, G8 protesters face the prospect of police using Stun Guns to halt anybody who would dare to cause trouble at the demo's.

http://news.scotsman.com/archive.cfm?id=549792005!

In my opinion, its the same old story - protect the numpties that kill millions of people becuause they have their greedy agenda's.
F*** the public's concerns - they are well controlled.

excuse the rant - its a very emotive issue.

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 21 May 2005, 11:20

Gracious. So there is near consensus here that instead of due legal process, human rights should be suspended for a 15 year-old, who should be subjected to either being shot, castrated, or systematically abused in prison.

And this is because, wait for it, *he/she* is an "animal"?

foxy · Post by **foxy** » 21 May 2005, 11:26

Dadaist wrote: I would rather be part of the solution than part of the problem.

So Dada let's hear the solution, as you see it

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 21 May 2005, 11:29

foxy wrote:
Dadaist wrote: I would rather be part of the solution than part of the problem.
So Dada let's hear the solution, as you see it

I never offered one. But that does not mean that I must keep silent as the rest of you argue for Saudi-style, or IRA-style "justice".

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 21 May 2005, 12:48

Dadaist wrote:Gracious. So there is near consensus here that instead of due legal process, human rights should be suspended for a 15 year-old, who should be subjected to either being shot, castrated, or systematically abused in prison.

And this is because, wait for it, *he/she* is an "animal"?

With you on this one Dadaist (although I do think we should take some postings with a large pinch of salt). The words 'paradoxical' and 'hypocritical' come to mind on reading some of these posts - how can we condemn an act of violence by suggesting a list of suitable barbaric punishments?
I haven't commented on this specific incident because I know very little about the circumstances. How many were truly involved in the attack?
Are some of the teenage witnesses to the attack as horrified as we at what transpired? Are they helping the Police identify the main culprit(s)?

To those that wonder where we are going wrong as a society I would argue that aggression among young males is not some new phenomena. Indeed, our armed services have relied on this factor for generations.

On a more general point, is it any surprise that we have such attacks when the Media glorify violence? By this I don't necessarily refer to computer games and Hollywood blockbusters, but to the normal day to day reporting of violent crime. For example, I hadn't heard of 'happy slapping' until a, much publicised, recent TV documentary. We obviously learned nothing from the experience of the 1980's documentary on 'glue sniffing' that resulted in the problem spreading quickly to other parts of the country. And am I the only person that feels angered by the glorification of violence in cities such as Glasgow by our journalists? Reports on gangland crime in Glasgow are frequently presented with an element of pride and the perpetrators presented as charismatic figures.
BTW I wish to make it clear that this post is not intended in anyway as a justification of such a sickening attack.

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 21 May 2005, 12:53

Dadaist wrote:Gracious. So there is near consensus here that instead of due legal process, human rights should be suspended for a 15 year-old, who should be subjected to either being shot, castrated, or systematically abused in prison.

And this is because, wait for it, *he/she* is an "animal"?

I understand the emotive language, and perhaps if it were my son who had been murdered I would want to wreak revenge on the perpetrators, but of course this is not the answer and I don't think anyone here seriously believes it to be. You don't solve these problems by sinking to the same level as the yobs.

At the same time I am extremely concerned at what is happening, not just in Portobello, but across the country and I think that some radical measures may have to be introduced to make our streets safer. Some of these measures may infringe on our civil liberties but perhaps that is the price we have to pay. As an example, we found from our questionnaire on provision for teenagers in the area that it's not just adults that are calling for more CCTV nowadays but kids as well, for their own protection.

Someone mentioned a curfew. Why not? Certainly, I don't think that kids under the age of 16 should be roaming the streets after 10pm. I know that this wouldn't have helped in the Piershill murder but it would address at least part of the problem.

The danger is that if things continue to deteriorate then people may well start to take matters into their own hands. Vigilantism isn't the answer but we do need decisive action and again I would urge everyone to write to their local councillors on this matter.

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 21 May 2005, 12:55

Well said, Bob & Marya.

foxy · Post by **foxy** » 21 May 2005, 12:59

Well said Bob and Marya.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 21 May 2005, 13:01

Thanks Foxy

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 21 May 2005, 13:03

oops my bad - i came in from my driving lesson and only scrolled up as far as bobs post - marya i didnt even see yours - oops - will correct presently

Talk Porty ~ Portobello

Kings Road teatime fights......

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