Transform golf courses into allotments?

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 06 Oct 2009, 16:05

admin: thread split from one of the school threads.

An editorial of some interest from today's evening news

http://edinburghnews.scotsman.com/opini ... 5706021.jp

seanie · Post by **seanie** » 07 Oct 2009, 22:31

The article that prompted it;

City tees up plan to transform golf courses into allotments

The latest audit found a quarter of all the city's open space is taken up by golf courses.

Dave Anderson, the council's director of city development, said: "Indications of falling demand for golf suggest potential over-provision of courses.

"Set in the context of significantly increased demand for other facilities such as allotments and sports pitches, this raises major strategic issues for open space as golf courses constitute a significant proportion of the city's total open-space resource."

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 26 Oct 2009, 11:03

It's an interesting situation. Let's face it - it has never been anything more than an alliance of convenience between PPAG and the golfers. Long after the idea of building a school on the golf course was ditched, it suited PPAG to perpetuate the myth that it was still under threat. Indeed, they continue to do so.

So, can the golfers count on the support of PPAG in the face of this new and very real threat to their course? I have said for years, and continue to hold the view, that we could make much better use of this space to provide a wider range of leisure facilities, including allotments, for the local community.

Wouldn't PEDAL love to have part of it? Or how about some public art - Big Things on the Park? There are probably dozens of better uses of this valuable space at the heart of the community and many of them could be accommodated, while retaining the area as open space.

What is the state of play at Telferton Allotments at present? Is it still under threat from developers?

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 26 Oct 2009, 12:15

Bob wrote:What is the state of play at Telferton Allotments at present? Is it still under threat from developers?

The delevopers appealed to the Scottish Government, but the Reporter upheld the local Council plan designating the land at Telferton as allotments.

Here's part of the report

I find that the existing use is providing amenity and leisure value to the local community in an area where there is not an overprovision of open space - and indeed in the context of a city-wide shortage of allotments. Accordingly, I conclude that in the present circumstances there is insufficient justification for amending the finalised local plan or its Proposals Map to allocate the site for housing development, as advocated by the objector (as a first preference). The merits of the case put forward by the objector (as a second preference) for the Council to purchase the land in question in order for it to continue being shown as allotments and toned as Open Space on the Proposals Map is a legal and financial matter outwith the scope of my deliberations.

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 27 Oct 2009, 08:39

So we currently have a waiting list of 2100 people for just 1230 plots. We have an under-provision of allotments and, apparently, an over-provision of golf courses. How many of those on the waiting list live in the Portobello area? I'm assuming that there is probably a limit to the travel time someone is prepared to make to access their allotment. Does each allotment have its own waiting list? If so, how many people are on the list for Telferton?

Although I feel we could make better use of the space occupied by the golf course, I'm not sure that ploughing the whole thing up for allotments is necessarily the right thing to do. That would merely be substituting one mono-culture for another. I would prefer that it met the needs of as many diverse interests as is possible, while remaining open space.

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 28 Oct 2009, 14:18

An open letter to PEDAL:

Dear PEDAL

Over on the local discussion forum, talkporty there is a new thread concerning the recent news that the Council is considering a plan to turn some of the public golf courses into allotments. This obviously has implications for the golf course in Portobello. I have attempted to broaden out the discussion to consider what other uses this green space could be put to in order to benefit the wider community.

I, and I'm sure the hundreds of other local people who view the forum, would be interested to know how the PEDAL steering group views the Council's proposal. It may be the case that not all members of the group are in agreement, in which case perhaps individual members might like to contribute to the ongoing discussion and share their views with us? Plenty of space for a community orchard, for example, and much else besides.

The thread in question can be found at: http://forum.talkporty.org/viewtopic.php?t=4738

Regards

Bob Jefferson

For info, according to their website, the PEDAL steering group currently comprises of:

Justin Kenrick, Eva Schonveld, Peter McColl , Diana Cairns, Stephen Hawkins, Jane Lewis, Dave Cooper, Mary Jane Elton, Chris Booth, Tom Black, Charlotte Bickmore, Emma Dempsey…

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 28 Oct 2009, 16:47

Part of the PHS success in securing their 4th Eco Flag was the fact they grow their own vegetables. Once PHS is on the Park it would be really handy for them if the Golf Course was in fact turned into allotments. They could even give the school quite a large area so that they could also grow vegetables to give to the elderly of Portobello.

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 06 Nov 2009, 20:11

I got this reply from PEDAL a couple of days ago:

Hi Bob,

PEDAL doesn't have a single view on this - we are a diverse bunch of folk working to try and support Portobello to be as resilient as possible in the face of climate change, rising fuel prices and likely further economic deterioration (as you can tell from the web site www.pedal-porty.org.uk). Good luck with your discussion forum.

best wishes, Justin

My discussion forum?

So, a predictable response, given the difficulties that those members of the steering group who are also prominent PPAG supporters will have with regards to the golfers, whose support they desperately need.

Because, let's face it, if it wasn't for this 'difficulty' then you can bet your patchouli oil that the steering group would be staking their claim for the golf course right now and quoting George Monbiot, who considers the proliferation of golf courses as "a pox upon the planet." Given the opportunity, PEDAL could be expected to facilitate several thousand pounds worth of grant-funded consultation with 'the community'. There would be discussion groups, drop-in workshops and visioning sessions along, of course, with a free lunch (featuring local organic produce) and creche.

There would be allotments, orchards, wind turbines, chickens...

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 07 Nov 2009, 01:17

Pedal wrote:Hi Bob,

PEDAL doesn't have a single view on this - we are a diverse bunch of folk working to try and support Portobello to be as resilient as possible in the face of climate change, rising fuel prices and likely further economic deterioration (as you can tell from the web site www.pedal-porty.org.uk). Good luck with your discussion forum.

best wishes, Justin

Justin- PEDALS' views are no doubt diverse. I've studied your website and I'm still unsure if any of your supporters prefer a golf course to; lets say allotments? I appreciate there isn't a "single view" - could you please elaborate on the struggles that cause the diverse beliefs in your organisation.

I'm fairly sure that given a clearer understanding of the thinking and motivation behind the PEDAL core- we can all become more resllient to climate change- help us!

I'm not sure whether there are 5,10 or 15 members of the PEDAL group. You tell Bob that there is no single view. which must mean that some are for and others are against allotments on the golf course. If some of PEDAL supporters prefer golf courses to more organic usage. I believe the fund raisng pool that you fish in ought to be aware- don't you? Am I right in thinking PEDAL sre purveying Porty as a "Transition Town"? Are we talking the golf course with us or what?

Surely a huge increase in allotment space in the area would be desirable on a number of levels? Once the golfie has attained allotment status it would be nye impossible for the council to build housing there. And PEDAL could maybe take over the "clubhouse" as its centre of operations, instlall a lookout tower with either Marya or a CCTV camera counting the lorries that are en route to Millerhill. Utopia is just around the corner.

.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 07 Nov 2009, 09:27

Bob Jefferson wrote:
Because, let's face it, if it wasn't for this 'difficulty' then you can bet your patchouli oil that the steering group would be staking their claim for the golf course right now and quoting George Monbiot, who considers the proliferation of golf courses as "a pox upon the planet."
...

Didn't Dode just mean private golf courses are a pox?

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 07 Nov 2009, 10:19

Yes, to be fair I'm sure that private courses are what he had in mind. The game is different in Scotland in that the public courses give it a more egalitarian ethos, although there is still plenty of exclusivity and snobbery on the private courses. But the point remains that golf courses, private or otherwise, are very land-greedy and environmentally-unfriendly. You can bet that all members of the PEDAL steering group were happy to denounce Donald Trump's ambitions.

Post by **wangi** » 07 Nov 2009, 12:11

Sorry, but this whole thread is just hot air. What's wrong with just leaving the golf course as-is? I don't see anyone jumping up and down with any better uses; any pressing needs.

Allotments would make the area even less accessible.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 07 Nov 2009, 12:51

Shortly after the EN published its editorial, I heard a council spokesperson being interviewed, in regards to the article, for Radio Scotland's breakfast news. The interview was very brief and went something along the lines of it being a total non story, conjured up by the EN's own interpretation of a council report.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 07 Nov 2009, 13:00

Porty wrote:. And PEDAL could maybe take over the "clubhouse" as its centre of operations, instlall a lookout tower with either Marya or a CCTV camera counting the lorries that are en route to Millerhill. Utopia is just around the corner.

.

Are you alleging I am a member of PEDAL?

I have you know I have a healthy anathema for all things bicycle related. Wouldn't catch me at a spinning class. How about yourself Porty?

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 07 Nov 2009, 14:10

Pal of Porty wrote:Part of the PHS success in securing their 4th Eco Flag was the fact they grow their own vegetables. Once PHS is on the Park it would be really handy for them if the Golf Course was in fact turned into allotments. They could even give the school quite a large area so that they could also grow vegetables to give to the elderly of Portobello.

The School already has a perfectly good plot at Telferton. Unfortunately, volunteer staff are even thinner on the ground than a lettuce in the antarctic so what makes you think this will change when you get a new school?

There are also loads of rugby/football pitches being wasted that could also be turned into allotments.

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 11 Nov 2009, 16:02

Epykat wrote: The School already has a perfectly good plot at Telferton. Unfortunately, volunteer staff are even thinner on the ground than a lettuce in the antarctic so what makes you think this will change when you get a new school? There are also loads of rugby/football pitches being wasted that could also be turned into allotments.

Telferton is miles away - with the Golfie all the new volunteers would just have to walk out the staff room door to get straight into the vegetable patch.

And as for rugby pitches - the Scotland team of the last the few years has enough vegetables in it already!

Bob Jefferson · Post by **Bob Jefferson** » 11 Nov 2009, 23:50

Marya wrote:The interview was very brief and went something along the lines of it being a total non story, conjured up by the EN's own interpretation of a council report.

Wot, the EN guilty of sensationalism? I'm sure the Council has no such plans for the immediate future, but the question has now been raised and it's an interesting question. I can't see them ploughing up the 18-hole courses but if a course was to be 'transformed' then Portobello is probably the most likely contender.

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 12 Nov 2009, 10:24

My Dad tells me that during the war the Government turned the Golfie into vegetable plots so people could eat.