A&E waiting times

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 18:18

Item on the news detailing that A&E patients who wait longer than 4 Hours for treatment has dropped from 23% in 2002 to just 5.3% in 2004. Personally, given the fact the 13M people visit A&E each year, I think that the 23% 2 years ago is an outstanding achievement. Never mind the improvement.

How good is a service that copes with 12.3m Accidents and Emergencies in less than 4 hours?

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 13 Oct 2004, 18:41

Porty wrote: How good is a service that copes with 12.3m Accidents and Emergencies in less than 4 hours?

I don't honestly know, because you just quoted the figures for England :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3733866.stm

ecm · Post by **ecm** » 13 Oct 2004, 19:07

A friend at work took her son to the ERI for an 8.30am appointment yesterday at one of the Outpatient depts. They were finally seen by the doctor at 11.00am!
At about 9.30am she enquired about the delay and was told that Dr. So and So likes to give all his patients his fullest attention and his schedule tended to run over as a result. When she then asked how much longer they might have to wait the reply was "How long is a piece of string?"

It's one thing to wait a few hours to be attended to in A and E but waiting over two hours for a scheduled appointment is ludicrous.
So much for the patients charter.

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 19:38

ecm wrote:It's one thing to wait a few hours to be attended to in A and E but waiting over two hours for a scheduled appointment is ludicrous.So much for the patients charter.

As someone who regulary attends outpatients at the ERI, I too have had the misfortune to sometimes wait over 2 hours for a scheduled appointment. This is unacceptable and needs improving.

However, this has to be viewed in the overall context of my treatment, which in my opinion has been nothing short of remarkable. The skills, talent and dedication of the entire medical team towards making me better has been so significantly above the call of duty it is staggering.

They really have been brilliant.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 19:45

Dadaist wrote:
Porty wrote: How good is a service that copes with 12.3m Accidents and Emergencies in less than 4 hours?
I don't honestly know, because you just quoted the figures for England :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3733866.stm

I did realise that (thought it was Wales too). Even if Scotland is twice or thrice as bad as 5.34% its still remarkable.

ecm · Post by **ecm** » 13 Oct 2004, 20:06

Pal of Porty wrote:The skills, talent and dedication of the entire medical team towards making me better has been so significantly above the call of duty it is staggering.
They really have been brilliant.

Glad to hear you're better now, PoP.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 20:18

ecm wrote:
Pal of Porty wrote:The skills, talent and dedication of the entire medical team towards making me better has been so significantly above the call of duty it is staggering.
They really have been brilliant.
Glad to hear you're better now, PoP.

ecm · Post by **ecm** » 13 Oct 2004, 20:22

You're a heartless beast!

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 20:23

ecm wrote:You're a heartless beast!

I used to have one.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 20:24

bellybabe · Post by **bellybabe** » 13 Oct 2004, 22:20

Porty wrote: I used to have one.

What happened dear, did you have an op at the new ERI where they took it out?

Beach Babe · Post by **Beach Babe** » 13 Oct 2004, 22:29

Bellybabe wrote:
Porty wrote: I used to have one.
What happened dear, did you have an op at the new ERI where they took it out?

hmmmmm

I thought that the casserole in the delightful hospital restaurant tasted a bit odd

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 22:34

Bellybabe wrote:
Porty wrote: I used to have one.
What happened dear, did you have an op at the new ERI where they took it out?

One christmas, I gave it to someone and the very next day they gave it away.

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 13 Oct 2004, 22:41

One christmas, I gave it to someone and the very next day they gave it away.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2004, 22:43

So, does anyone else think these A&E stats are something to be both amazed and proud of?

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 14 Oct 2004, 11:34

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 14 Oct 2004, 23:35

Marya wrote:"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."

Are you saying that Managers, Unions, Staff and Patients are conspiring to delude the GBP? On what are you basing your inference?

ifstar · Post by **ifstar** » 15 Oct 2004, 09:16

It is quite an impressive time although it would be interesting to find out what percent are seen within say 2 hours - i can imagine hanging about for 4 hours in AE waiting to be seen could be quite bad if you are in some pain.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 15 Oct 2004, 09:30

Porty wrote:

On what are you basing your inference?

Statistics can tell you whatever you want your audience to hear according to the criterion used, you'll know that Porty. I always distrust 75% of all statistics I read.

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 15 Oct 2004, 09:35

Marya wrote:I always distrust 75% of all statistics I read.

Yeah - Especially when 95% of all statistics are made up.

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 16 Oct 2004, 18:41

ifstar wrote:It is quite an impressive time although it would be interesting to find out what percent are seen within say 2 hours - i can imagine hanging about for 4 hours in AE waiting to be seen could be quite bad if you are in some pain.

When Mr E visited A&E after his little accident on the football pitch (which effectively ended a distinguished 30 year career

) he was seen in a very impressive 15 minutes BUT only by a triage nurse - he then waited about 2 hours to be seen by a Doctor. So........are these statistics based on people being SEEN (whether it's by a Receptionist, Porter, Nurse or an actual Doctor) or are they based on being TREATED?

Sandra · Post by **Sandra** » 16 Oct 2004, 22:26

In my experience (from numerous visits to A&E) average time is 4 hour wait

mr magnolia · Post by **mr magnolia** » 18 Oct 2004, 16:39

Epykat wrote:
ifstar wrote:. So........are these statistics based on people being SEEN (whether it's by a Receptionist, Porter, Nurse or an actual Doctor) or are they based on being TREATED?

put a tick by the first bit, Epykat - its seen by the triage person, thats why they were introduced. Oh of course there is a medical benefit in that triaging helps categorise patients so that the less your need is, the greater the wait thereafter. Which is not entirely unfair...

Government departments and large organisations of all types do the same thing - they will reply very quickly to your query with a non-answer and then reply very much later with something approximating to a real answer.

CatzVP · Post by **CatzVP** » 19 Oct 2004, 06:54

Longest the Wife or I have waited was less than an hour which strangely enough still got quite a few people complaining....Some poeple are never pleased.

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 19 Oct 2004, 12:11

[quote="mr magnolia] Which is not entirely unfair...[/quote]

No it's not unfair but they should really advertise the little gem that is The Western General's Minor Injuries Clinic -open 9am-9pm. However, it is sometimes difficult to ascertain whether a broken ankle is a minor injury when you're not a Nurse or a Doctor! Pain thresholds are the setback here!

bouncie_kiwi · Post by **bouncie_kiwi** » 24 Apr 2007, 02:06

i think to comment on statistics, you would have to run a series of relevance tests - download SPSS then perform a few chi-squared, paired sample t-tests and non-parametric tests on the original result numbers, comparisons etc then comment on the "difference in actual waiting times"
oh, and remember to add in the people who died waiting on treatment - oops there goes another one dead in the waiting room, someone please get the vacuum cleaner there appears to be a large pile of dust beside them - oh shoot we forgot about that patient!

Realistically though, my main gripe with A&E is the UNTRAINED reception staff who think they have the authority and knowledge to decide what calssifies as an emergency or a "minor complaint"
When somebody with a known glomerular filtration rate of 40 passes out three times, develops random oedema and starts to throw up - this is hardly a "minor complaint"

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 24 Apr 2007, 09:24

bouncie_kiwi wrote:i

Realistically though, my main gripe with A&E is the UNTRAINED reception staff who think they have the authority and knowledge to decide what calssifies as an emergency or a "minor complaint"

Isn't that a bit like a expecting scotmid checkout staff to be trained to give dietary advice to a one-off customer who only popped in for a gazebo?

SoupDragon · Post by **SoupDragon** » 24 Apr 2007, 11:09

Then waited 4 hours to buy it?

bouncie_kiwi · Post by **bouncie_kiwi** » 24 Apr 2007, 13:34

Isn't that a bit like a expecting scotmid checkout staff to be trained to give dietary advice to a one-off customer who only popped in for a gazebo?

hehe i suppose it is - they may want to eat the gazebo along with their "chup pork",
lol, i'm not saying they "should" be trained - it is merely the fact they seem to THINK they are medical experts

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 24 Apr 2007, 14:24

Bad attitude seems to be rife among reception staff at NHS facilities, doesn't it?

I have to be a we bit careful here as I know we have users who are either current or former medical receptionists.

When I visit my surgery I never know what to expect, it ranges from very nice to positively hostile but even the nice ones can be hostile on occasion (Angie I hope you are not reading this

). I never experienced Epykat's reception deskside manner but I can't imagine her being anything other than very pleasant.

The same problem seems to affect School office staff.

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 24 Apr 2007, 15:23

Porty wrote:I never experienced Epykat's reception deskside manner but I can't imagine her being anything other than very pleasant.

The same problem seems to affect School office staff.

My reception deskside manner was nothing short of professional I have to say

. Problem with the public is that they're the public and they think they are the ONLY person needing to see a Doctor. That said however I did work with some people who thought that the appointments were actually theirs and they didn't want to give any away. In my experience Consultants' secretaries are by far the worst as far as helpfulness and manners are concerned. It's the stress.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 24 Apr 2007, 15:45

SoupDragon wrote:Then waited 4 hours to buy it?

teddygirl · Post by **teddygirl** » 24 Apr 2007, 16:02

I can vouch for Epykats excellent reception desk manner. She was polite, helpful, accomodating, cheerful and an expert at muttering and cursing discretely under her breath

SoupDragon · Post by **SoupDragon** » 24 Apr 2007, 18:53

See they replaced her with a touch screen thingy

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 24 Apr 2007, 18:58

SoupDragon wrote:See they replaced her with a touch screen thingy

More personality?

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A&E waiting times

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